Name: On World Religions Diversity not Dissension March 9, 2013 — Maulana Wahiduddin Khan
Uploaded: 2013-01-01
Duration: 41 min 32 s
Channel: Maulana Wahiduddin Khan
Description: Read the full transcript of “On World Religions Diversity not Dissension March 9, 2013”, a lecture by Maulana Wahiduddin Khan, with timestamps.

0:13 namaskar. We are celebrating the 150th birth anniversary of Swami Vivekananda by holding an international conference on world religions, diversity, not dissension. नमस्कार। We are celebrating the 150th birth anniversary of Swami Vivekananda by holding an international conference on world religions, diversity, not dissension.

0:32 We are We are

0:33 doing so precisely because Swami Vivekananda's thoughts are particularly relevant and important for the contemporary multi-religious situation that we have worldwide today. doing so precisely because Swami Vivekananda's thoughts are particularly relevant and important for the contemporary multi-religious situation that we have worldwide today.

0:49 This conference has been inaugurated by the Honorable President of India, Shri Pranab Mukherjee, at the Rashtrapati Bhavan itself. This conference has been inaugurated by the Honorable President of India, Shri Pranab Mukherjee, at the Rashtrapati Bhavan itself.

0:59 During the past two days, we have been deliberating on various key issues that touch upon multiple aspects of this very large and complex theme. During the past two days, we have been deliberating on various key issues that touch upon multiple aspects of this very large and complex theme.

1:14 This has been going on at Azad Bhavan, which is the seat of ICCR. Today is the final session of this international conference. This has been going on at Azad Bhavan, which is the seat of ICCR. Today is the final session of this international conference.

1:28 Well, when you think about our preoccupation with these questions today, it is quite natural to recall that only two to three decades ago, Well, when you think about our preoccupation with these questions today, it is quite natural to recall that only two to three decades ago,

1:41 there were speculations in some quarters that with the spread of secular political ideology and sharing of scientific technology, the influence of religious traditions will gradually subside. there were speculations in some quarters that with the spread of secular political ideology and sharing of scientific technology, the influence of religious traditions will gradually subside.

1:59 However, that prediction has proven to be wrong. And we know that the religions of the world are very much with us. However, that prediction has proven to be wrong. And we know that the religions of the world are very much with us.

2:10 A common sharing of advanced technology that has facilitated travel and communication in an unprecedented manner has made it all the more clear to us that we are by no means living in a post-religious era. A common sharing of advanced technology that has facilitated travel and communication in an unprecedented manner has made it all the more clear to us that we are by no means living in a post-religious era.

2:32 Swami Vivekananda had observed, "Of all the forces that have worked and are still working to mold the destinies of the human race, none certainly is more potent than that, the manifestation of which we call religion." Swami Vivekananda had observed, "Of all the forces that have worked and are still working to mold the destinies of the human race, none certainly is more potent than that, the manifestation of which we call religion."

2:55 Perhaps the single most dominant criterion used in the public discourse for distinguishing the largest human aggregates one from the other is by their religious identity, Perhaps the single most dominant criterion used in the public discourse for distinguishing the largest human aggregates one from the other is by their religious identity,

3:10 associated with one or another of the religions of the world. associated with one or another of the religions of the world.

3:16 Indeed, the world religions still are continuing to be the primary sources from which the largest aggregates of humanity draw their norms and values, derive their sense of collective identity, Indeed, the world religions still are continuing to be the primary sources from which the largest aggregates of humanity draw their norms and values, derive their sense of collective identity,

3:32 and seek guidance in times of need. Consequently, the presence of the plurality of religious identities is an inalienable fact of the contemporary global scen and seek guidance in times of need. Consequently, the presence of the plurality of religious identities is an inalienable fact of the contemporary global scen

3:46 e. It is a phenomenon that has to be dealt with at multiple levels of exchanges and interactions by all of us. e. It is a phenomenon that has to be dealt with at multiple levels of exchanges and interactions by all of us.

3:55 Today, then, the central question before us is, can we move on to a plane of collective existence when the presence of diversity of religious traditions will no longer be seen as a cause for dissension, Today, then, the central question before us is, can we move on to a plane of collective existence when the presence of diversity of religious traditions will no longer be seen as a cause for dissension,

4:11 as it has often been the case before as it has often been the case before

4:17 ? Is it at all possible for us to view the religions of the world as our common resource that can enrich and empower us in ways that we cannot even imagine today? ? Is it at all possible for us to view the religions of the world as our common resource that can enrich and empower us in ways that we cannot even imagine today?

4:32 If we could, or even give it an honest try, we could then claim that we are indeed seeking to carry forward a project that was initiated by Swami Vivekananda. If we could, or even give it an honest try, we could then claim that we are indeed seeking to carry forward a project that was initiated by Swami Vivekananda.

4:47 While exploring these issues with the eminent personalities present here, I have chosen this conversational format in order to highlight that the endeavor here is not just to invite a series of monologues, While exploring these issues with the eminent personalities present here, I have chosen this conversational format in order to highlight that the endeavor here is not just to invite a series of monologues,

5:05 but to find out how can we gradually innovate a setting, especially with a view to facilitate the bridge-building task among the religions of the world. but to find out how can we gradually innovate a setting, especially with a view to facilitate the bridge-building task among the religions of the world.

5:18 This is a humble attempt to carry forward Swami Vivekananda's unfinished project of enhancing harmony and avoiding dissensions among religions of the world. This is a humble attempt to carry forward Swami Vivekananda's unfinished project of enhancing harmony and avoiding dissensions among religions of the world.

5:34 Speaking of religious identity, let me just use a couple of minutes more for trying to understand the genesis that is the beginning and the constitution of religious identity, as it is generally referred to in common parlance or in the context of our sociopolitical collective lives. Speaking of religious identity, let me just use a couple of minutes more for trying to understand the genesis that is the beginning and the constitution of religious identity, as it is generally referred to in common parlance or in the context of our sociopolitical collective lives.

5:58 Let's begin by asking whether we deliberately choose these identities, or are these, by and large, attributed to us by the accident of birth. Let's begin by asking whether we deliberately choose these identities, or are these, by and large, attributed to us by the accident of birth.

6:11 The picture seems to me, at least, to be very much as follows: one is first born into a tradition, a religious tradition, belongs to it, and only later one can say that the tradition belongs to one. The picture seems to me, at least, to be very much as follows: one is first born into a tradition, a religious tradition, belongs to it, and only later one can say that the tradition belongs to one.

6:28 Wh Wh

6:29 ile considering the question of dissension that often happens in the name of religious identity, it's indeed interesting to note that only comparatively very few of us actually get to choose their religious identity. ile considering the question of dissension that often happens in the name of religious identity, it's indeed interesting to note that only comparatively very few of us actually get to choose their religious identity.

6:46 As that would imply, most of the time, exiting from the tradition into which one is born. As that would imply, most of the time, exiting from the tradition into which one is born.

6:55 There are such cases, of cours There are such cases, of cours

6:57 e. There are examples of persons sittingright here that I know of where one has been born in a specific religious tradition into a tradition and then has exited from it and has chosen another tradition. e. There are examples of persons sittingright here that I know of where one has been born in a specific religious tradition into a tradition and then has exited from it and has chosen another tradition.

7:13 We also know that there are many cases where people have been persuaded, forced, and even persecuted to exit from traditions into which they are born. We also know that there are many cases where people have been persuaded, forced, and even persecuted to exit from traditions into which they are born.

7:25 But But

7:26 even in such endeavors, would we really not hesitate to call that these are cases of deliberate choice? even in such endeavors, would we really not hesitate to call that these are cases of deliberate choice?

7:36 In other words, wherever there is no real option before us, there is no question of exercising choice. In other words, wherever there is no real option before us, there is no question of exercising choice.

7:46 Thus, to start with, this is my humble submission that we are born into a given religious tradition, and this is not a case of choosing. Thus, to start with, this is my humble submission that we are born into a given religious tradition, and this is not a case of choosing.

7:57 Now, my first of the four clusters of questions: What do you consider to be the principal teaching of your tradition Now, my first of the four clusters of questions: What do you consider to be the principal teaching of your tradition

8:07 ? What is it that has especially inspired you most, impelling you to serve your tradition all throughout your life, that we cannot simply attribute to the fact of your being connected with it by the accident of birth? ? What is it that has especially inspired you most, impelling you to serve your tradition all throughout your life, that we cannot simply attribute to the fact of your being connected with it by the accident of birth?

8:26 But will we be willing to grant that it could just as well be the case had it been a matter of deliberate choice? But will we be willing to grant that it could just as well be the case had it been a matter of deliberate choice?

8:36 In other words, is there a central message that is specific to your tradition that you wish to share with the entire humanity because you firmly believe that we will all live in a better world if we pay heed to it? In other words, is there a central message that is specific to your tradition that you wish to share with the entire humanity because you firmly believe that we will all live in a better world if we pay heed to it?

8:57 bismillah al-rahman al-rahim. بسم اللہ الرحمن الرحیم۔

9:03 I was born in a Muslim family. My education, my upbringing, was on the traditional lines. I was born in a Muslim family. My education, my upbringing, was on the traditional lines.

9:22 But when I reached the age of maturity, I developed doubts. I discovered that I am a seeker and was sad with that version of Islam that But when I reached the age of maturity, I developed doubts. I discovered that I am a seeker and was sad with that version of Islam that

9:45 I experienced in masjid, in madrasa, and in Muslim society. I experienced in masjid, in madrasa, and in Muslim society.

9:51 It was a very tragic moment for me. It was a very tragic moment for me.

10:00 Then, unbelievably, an event happened. Then, unbelievably, an event happened.

10:10 At that time, I decided to study all those details about religion, spirituality, philosophy, to discover the answer of my natu At that time, I decided to study all those details about religion, spirituality, philosophy, to discover the answer of my natu

10:29 re. It is very interesting that at this juncture, I read some of Swami Gandha's work, especially letters of Swami Vivekananda. re. It is very interesting that at this juncture, I read some of Swami Gandha's work, especially letters of Swami Vivekananda.

10:49 In this book, there is a letter number 175 In this book, there is a letter number 175

10:57 . In this letter, Swamiji had mentioned Islam in very shiny words. . In this letter, Swamiji had mentioned Islam in very shiny words.

11:07 This triggered my mind. This triggered my mind.

11:13 This mention of Swami Vivekananda triggered my mind. I decided to restudy Islam. This mention of Swami Vivekananda triggered my mind. I decided to restudy Islam.

11:21 It was a very interesting study. It was a very interesting study.

11:25 So what happened after a long study of Quran and Sunnah, another relevant teacher, I discovered that Islam was my choice, although it was not my birth religion. So what happened after a long study of Quran and Sunnah, another relevant teacher, I discovered that Islam was my choice, although it was not my birth religion.

11:50 I can say that I am not a Muslim by birth, but I am a Muslim by choice. And here I would like to mention that Swami Vivekananda is my benefactor. I can say that I am not a Muslim by birth, but I am a Muslim by choice. And here I would like to mention that Swami Vivekananda is my benefactor.

12:07 I can say that Swamiji is my benefac I can say that Swamiji is my benefac

12:10 tor. He gave me a very important clue at that time because I am a very rational person, very rational. tor. He gave me a very important clue at that time because I am a very rational person, very rational.

12:26 I tried to reason out everything. I tried to reason out everything.

12:33 So due to this mindset, I became dissatisfied with the prevalent version of Islam and also the Muslim society. So due to this mindset, I became dissatisfied with the prevalent version of Islam and also the Muslim society.

12:50 But after a long study, I discovered that there is a difference between Islam and Muslims. I was confused between the two. But after a long study, I discovered that there is a difference between Islam and Muslims. I was confused between the two.

13:00 Before this study, I was confused between the two. After this study, I discovered that there is a difference between Islam and Muslims. Before this study, I was confused between the two. After this study, I discovered that there is a difference between Islam and Muslims.

13:12 If you want to know what is Islam, you have to differentiate between the two. You have to judge Muslims in the light of Islamic teachings and not vice versa. If you want to know what is Islam, you have to differentiate between the two. You have to judge Muslims in the light of Islamic teachings and not vice versa.

13:28 Now, what I discovered during this study, I discovered that there are two basic tenets in Islam, basic tenets. Now, what I discovered during this study, I discovered that there are two basic tenets in Islam, basic tenets.

13:42 One is One is

13:46 that that

13:50 man should make God his sole concern man should make God his sole concern

13:57 . God is our sole concern. We have to make Him our sole concern. And the other is that well-wishing to all mankind. . God is our sole concern. We have to make Him our sole concern. And the other is that well-wishing to all mankind.

14:12 All these questions were answered. All these questions were answered.

14:15 So I can say that I am not a Muslim by birth, but a Muslim by choice. So I can say that I am not a Muslim by birth, but a Muslim by choice.

14:26 And Swami Vivekananda is my benefactor. I can say that Swami Vivekananda is my spiritual guru. And Swami Vivekananda is my benefactor. I can say that Swami Vivekananda is my spiritual guru.

14:37 In our collective existence, we see that these facts of religious affiliation have had actually a dual impact: benevolent and pernicious, In our collective existence, we see that these facts of religious affiliation have had actually a dual impact: benevolent and pernicious,

14:51 be that in the history of two denominations of the same tradition or when the religious context is definitively plural in character. be that in the history of two denominations of the same tradition or when the religious context is definitively plural in character.

15:02 Swamiji said, Swami Vivekananda, "No other human motive has deluded the world with blood so much as religion. Swamiji said, Swami Vivekananda, "No other human motive has deluded the world with blood so much as religion.

15:13 At the same time, no other human influence has taken such care not only of humanity but also of the lowest of animals as religion has done. At the same time, no other human influence has taken such care not only of humanity but also of the lowest of animals as religion has done.

15:24 Nothing makes us so cruel as religion. Nothing makes us so tender as religion." Nothing makes us so cruel as religion. Nothing makes us so tender as religion."

15:31 Now, you know, we have seen this cruel aspect has been played out in such gruesome manner in the name of religious identity that we really need to understand what makes that possible, what is at the root of it. Now, you know, we have seen this cruel aspect has been played out in such gruesome manner in the name of religious identity that we really need to understand what makes that possible, what is at the root of it.

15:47 I have said at the beginning that we draw a sense of collective identity from our religions. I have said at the beginning that we draw a sense of collective identity from our religions.

15:55 Let me now ask: What is entailed in the teachings of these diverse traditions, explicitly or implicitly, that influence us to construe the otherness of other traditions in specific ways that have an impact on those whom we do not perceive to be the members of our own religious community? Let me now ask: What is entailed in the teachings of these diverse traditions, explicitly or implicitly, that influence us to construe the otherness of other traditions in specific ways that have an impact on those whom we do not perceive to be the members of our own religious community?

16:21 So my second cluster of questions to you is: What is the status of the other in the philosophy of religion of your own tradition? So my second cluster of questions to you is: What is the status of the other in the philosophy of religion of your own tradition?

16:34 What is the explicit or implicit teaching that is bound to influence the attitude of members of your own community as and when they invariably encounter these others, that is, What is the explicit or implicit teaching that is bound to influence the attitude of members of your own community as and when they invariably encounter these others, that is,

16:48 those who happen to derive their sense of religious identity from sources other than your own, that they are to be gradually vanquished, to be eventually converted for the sake of their own good, those who happen to derive their sense of religious identity from sources other than your own, that they are to be gradually vanquished, to be eventually converted for the sake of their own good,

17:05 that those who are reluctant to do so are to be perceived as doomed, or at best to be situated at a lower level in the hierarchy and somehow tolerated? that those who are reluctant to do so are to be perceived as doomed, or at best to be situated at a lower level in the hierarchy and somehow tolerated?

17:18 In other words, the question is whether it is possible for us to be more inclusive. Can these others be at all accepted as followers of a distinctly different path, yet recognizably a legitimate path? In other words, the question is whether it is possible for us to be more inclusive. Can these others be at all accepted as followers of a distinctly different path, yet recognizably a legitimate path?

17:34 If yes, on what ground? You know, Muslims generally divide the world between Muslims and non-Muslims, If yes, on what ground? You know, Muslims generally divide the world between Muslims and non-Muslims,

17:50 Muslim world and non-Muslim world. This kind of terminology is completely wrong and Islamic. It has no basis in the Quran and Sunnah. Muslim world and non-Muslim world. This kind of terminology is completely wrong and Islamic. It has no basis in the Quran and Sunnah.

18:04 If you read the Quran, you will find that the Quran always uses the word "Insan, Insan, Insan." It means that those terms which were created by the Ulama in the later period, "Dharul Islam" and "Dharul Kufr," were wrong. If you read the Quran, you will find that the Quran always uses the word "Insan, Insan, Insan." It means that those terms which were created by the Ulama in the later period, "Dharul Islam" and "Dharul Kufr," were wrong.

18:27 The real term is "Dharul Insan, Dharul Insan, Dharul Insan." The real term is "Dharul Insan, Dharul Insan, Dharul Insan."

18:33 The whole world is "Dharul Insan." So in this world, there is only one equation. The whole world is "Dharul Insan." So in this world, there is only one equation.

18:42 There is man and God, and not man and not Muslim and non-Muslim. There is no equation. There is man and God, and not man and not Muslim and non-Muslim. There is no equation.

18:52 The true equation, theright equation, is: Creator are God and man. The true equation, theright equation, is: Creator are God and man.

19:00 I am a great believer in God. Also, I am a great believer in the I am a great believer in God. Also, I am a great believer in the

19:09 oneness of humanity. oneness of humanity.

19:14 Then I would like to say that they said in modern terms, several Muslim countries have adopted the term "Islamic Jamaahiyya" (Islamic Jamaahiyya). Then I would like to say that they said in modern terms, several Muslim countries have adopted the term "Islamic Jamaahiyya" (Islamic Jamaahiyya).

19:29 This term is completely wrong. You know, the Prophet of Islam never used this term. The Prophet of Islam and his Khalifa never used the term "Islamic Jamaahiyya." So everyone, every bulk will be called with its natural name. This term is completely wrong. You know, the Prophet of Islam never used this term. The Prophet of Islam and his Khalifa never used the term "Islamic Jamaahiyya." So everyone, every bulk will be called with its natural name.

19:52 By India, it is India. And England, it is England. And Iran, it is Iran. No country can be called "Islamic Jamaahiyya." This is wrong. By India, it is India. And England, it is England. And Iran, it is Iran. No country can be called "Islamic Jamaahiyya." This is wrong.

20:09 Then I would like to add that the concept of perversion is alien to the Quran. Then I would like to add that the concept of perversion is alien to the Quran.

20:18 I would like to say that if you want to know what Islam is, you have to read the Quran. I would like to say that if you want to know what Islam is, you have to read the Quran.

20:28 There are only two sources of Islam: there is the Quran and Sunnah. So there is no concept of perversion; it has no basis in the Quran. There are only two sources of Islam: there is the Quran and Sunnah. So there is no concept of perversion; it has no basis in the Quran.

20:41 The Quran uses "Ma'rifah." Ma'rifah means realization, discovery. So truth is your own discovery. The Quran uses "Ma'rifah." Ma'rifah means realization, discovery. So truth is your own discovery.

20:52 Truth is your own realization. It is a personal choice. Truth is your own realization. It is a personal choice.

21:00 If you want to know what is the purpose of life, what is If you want to know what is the purpose of life, what is

21:10 death, and what is life, all those questions that are in your mind, if you want to understand about these question death, and what is life, all those questions that are in your mind, if you want to understand about these question

21:22 s, you have to study. You have to discuss. And after discussion and study, you reach some conclusion. s, you have to study. You have to discuss. And after discussion and study, you reach some conclusion.

21:34 That is your religion. So religion is your personal choice. There is no concept of perversion in Islam. That is your religion. So religion is your personal choice. There is no concept of perversion in Islam.

21:43 In perversion, you know, there are two parties: converter and converted. Two parties: converter and converted. In perversion, you know, there are two parties: converter and converted. Two parties: converter and converted.

21:56 But this is not the concept of Islam. In Islam, there is only one party. There is you. If you want to know what is truth, you have to study on your o But this is not the concept of Islam. In Islam, there is only one party. There is you. If you want to know what is truth, you have to study on your o

22:09 wn. And when you discover something as a truth, you have to ask for that. Then there is a question. This world is full of differences. wn. And when you discover something as a truth, you have to ask for that. Then there is a question. This world is full of differences.

22:21 Everywhere there are differences. Among family members, there are differences. And in society, there are differences. Everywhere there are differences. Among family members, there are differences. And in society, there are differences.

22:31 Even in one religion, there are differences. So what to do? Even in one religion, there are differences. So what to do?

22:38 The best answer was given by Swami Vivekananda: "Follow one and hate none. Follow one and hate none." This answer is also mentioned in the Quran: "Lakum dinukum waliadin. The best answer was given by Swami Vivekananda: "Follow one and hate none. Follow one and hate none." This answer is also mentioned in the Quran: "Lakum dinukum waliadin.

22:54 For you your religion, for me mine." So I have foregoated this Quranic verse in these words: "Follow one and respect all. For you your religion, for me mine." So I have foregoated this Quranic verse in these words: "Follow one and respect all.

23:08 Follow one and respect all." This is the only practical solution how to deal with differences. We cannot eliminate differences. Follow one and respect all." This is the only practical solution how to deal with differences. We cannot eliminate differences.

23:20 Differences are part of life. So we have to manage differences rather than try to eliminate the differences. Differences are part of life. So we have to manage differences rather than try to eliminate the differences.

23:29 So the best answer is that: "Follow one and respect all." So the best answer is that: "Follow one and respect all."

23:37 Now let me move on to the next concern. Those who are familiar with Swamiji's writings know that in many places he has pointed out how noble ideas get trivialized by people of sectarian mentality. Now let me move on to the next concern. Those who are familiar with Swamiji's writings know that in many places he has pointed out how noble ideas get trivialized by people of sectarian mentality.

23:55 He has joked about how, for example, the idea of universal brotherhood has been used by some Muslims and Christians. He has joked about how, for example, the idea of universal brotherhood has been used by some Muslims and Christians.

24:03 How How

24:04 ever, when referring to failures and shortcomings of the Hindu community, he has expressed his disapproval in strongest terms, sometimes even more harshly, even so harshly that it is difficult to believe, ever, when referring to failures and shortcomings of the Hindu community, he has expressed his disapproval in strongest terms, sometimes even more harshly, even so harshly that it is difficult to believe,

24:21 but always in all cases with the intent of reminding the followers of specific traditions that they have to live up to the highest ideals of their own traditions, that their social practices and institutions have to comply with those ideals. but always in all cases with the intent of reminding the followers of specific traditions that they have to live up to the highest ideals of their own traditions, that their social practices and institutions have to comply with those ideals.

24:41 So my third question to you all is this: So my third question to you all is this:

24:48 Now, I will request you to take on a self-critical posture and tell us openly whether you have noticed any event or a display of an attitude or an institutionalized custom or practice that has been carried out in the past or is still in vogue in the name of your own religious tradition that you have worn, Now, I will request you to take on a self-critical posture and tell us openly whether you have noticed any event or a display of an attitude or an institutionalized custom or practice that has been carried out in the past or is still in vogue in the name of your own religious tradition that you have worn,

25:16 because you are convinced that no matter how that has come about, it is surely against the spirit of your tradition. because you are convinced that no matter how that has come about, it is surely against the spirit of your tradition.

25:26 Please give us at least one concrete example and then tell us what you think needs to be done in order to eradicate it or prevent it Please give us at least one concrete example and then tell us what you think needs to be done in order to eradicate it or prevent it

25:36 . As far as the religion of Islam is concerned, I have never found any principles or tenets in Islam about which I can say that I abhor this principle. . As far as the religion of Islam is concerned, I have never found any principles or tenets in Islam about which I can say that I abhor this principle.

25:52 No. But as far as the Muslim community is concerned, I have a number of complaints towards the Muslim community. No. But as far as the Muslim community is concerned, I have a number of complaints towards the Muslim community.

26:01 For example, almost all the present Muslims live in negative thinking. Almost all the Muslims. For example, almost all the present Muslims live in negative thinking. Almost all the Muslims.

26:12 I traveled so many countries, from India to the USA, from India to Arab countries. I traveled so many countries, from India to the USA, from India to Arab countries.

26:21 Everywhere I have found, those Muslims are living in negativity. They always complain about other nations. Everywhere I have found, those Muslims are living in negativity. They always complain about other nations.

26:32 Arabs say that America is "Adhoob al-Islam rakam vahid." Other Muslims say America is the enemy number one of Islam. Arabs say that America is "Adhoob al-Islam rakam vahid." Other Muslims say America is the enemy number of Islam.

26:44 This is wrong, completely wrong. This is wrong, completely wrong.

26:49 According to Quranic teachings, and I don't believe that anyone is our enemy. According to Quranic teachings, and I don't believe that anyone is our enemy.

26:59 I don't believe this notion. But if there is any enemy, for the sake of argument, I would say that if there is any enemy, then what the Quran says? I don't believe this notion. But if there is any enemy, for the sake of argument, I would say that if there is any enemy, then what the Quran says?

27:17 There is a verse in the Quran: There is a verse in the Quran:

27:28 It means that do good deeds in return for bad deeds, "It means that do good deeds in return for bad deeds,

27:36 and you will find that your enemy has become your dearest friend." What a revolutionary idea! According to this Quranic verse, there is no and you will find that your enemy has become your dearest friend." What a revolutionary idea! According to this Quranic verse, there is no

27:52 enemy. Every human being is either your friend or potential friend. So turn this potential into actual. enemy. Every human being is either your friend or potential friend. So turn this potential into actual.

28:02 So why complain against an enemy? So why complain against an enemy?

28:05 So I have completely So I have completely

28:11 rejected this idea that the world is our enemy. They are conspirators. Then the other aspect of this negative thinking is that when you live in negative thinking, rejected this idea that the world is our enemy. They are conspirators. Then the other aspect of this negative thinking is that when you live in negative thinking,

28:27 you will lose the greatest blessing of God, you will lose the greatest blessing of God,

28:33 because all the blessings of God lie in positive thinking. Positive thinking. If you are a positive thinker, then you are able to develop your mind. because all the blessings of God lie in positive thinking. Positive thinking. If you are a positive thinker, then you are able to develop your mind.

28:50 Intellectual development and spiritual development Intellectual development and spiritual development

28:57 is based completely on positive think is based completely on positive think

29:00 ing. So those Muslims who are living in negative thinking, in negative thought, they have deprived themselves by spiritual development and by intellectual development. ing. So those Muslims who are living in negative thinking, in negative thought, they have deprived themselves by spiritual development and by intellectual development.

29:14 So this kind of thinking is completely wrong. And I abhor this kind of thinking, although all the Muslims are living in this thought. So this kind of thinking is completely wrong. And I abhor this kind of thinking, although all the Muslims are living in this thought.

29:25 Recently, I participated in a Muslim seminar. Recently, I participated in a Muslim seminar.

29:33 There were so many Muslim scholars, and all were educated. And what was the gist of that seminar? There were so many Muslim scholars, and all were educated. And what was the gist of that seminar?

29:42 They said that Muslims are under siege. This was their word. Muslims are living under siege. They said that Muslims are under siege. This was their word. Muslims are living under siege.

29:53 This is completely wrong. This is completely wrong.

29:58 You know, I am in India. You know, I am in India.

30:00 I am proud to be an Indian because I believe that in India, I am better than all those Muslim countries. I am proud to be an Indian because I believe that in India, I am better than all those Muslim countries.

30:13 You know, there are 58 Muslim countries. I have traveled to all Muslim countries. You know, there are 58 Muslim countries. I have traveled to all Muslim countries.

30:20 But I can say with conviction that in India, I found more opportunities than are prevalent in those Muslim countries. But I can say with conviction that in India, I found more opportunities than are prevalent in those Muslim countries.

30:34 For example, if you want to do something, For example, if you want to do something,

30:44 there are two conditions: there are two conditions:

30:47 one, peace, and the second, freedom. Without peace and freedom, you cannot do anything, any great thing. one, peace, and the second, freedom. Without peace and freedom, you cannot do anything, any great thing.

30:57 And I can say according to my experience, but in Muslim countries, you cannot find both. If in any country there is freedom, there is no peace. And I can say according to my experience, but in Muslim countries, you cannot find both. If in any country there is freedom, there is no peace.

31:09 And if there is peace, there is no freedom. But in India, I enjoy the both And if there is peace, there is no freedom. But in India, I enjoy the both

31:17 . In India, I enjoy the both. Here, I enjoy peace. Peace, and at the same time, I enjoy freedom. So I always . In India, I enjoy the both. Here, I enjoy peace. Peace, and at the same time, I enjoy freedom. So I always

31:30 live in shukr that I was born in India. Otherwise, it is not possible for me to start this m live in shukr that I was born in India. Otherwise, it is not possible for me to start this m

31:40 ission. I know so many people who were born in other Muslim countries, and they started missions like myself, and they were gunned down. ission. I know so many people who were born in other Muslim countries, and they started missions like myself, and they were gunned down.

31:53 They were compelled to exile their country. But I am here in India. I am completely free. Completely free. They were compelled to exile their country. But I am here in India. I am completely free. Completely free.

32:02 There is no restriction for me. There is no restriction for me.

32:05 So this kind of thinking, the negative thinking, I abhor it. And So this kind of thinking, the negative thinking, I abhor it. And

32:14 I can say that unless Muslims abandon this kind of thinking, they cannot progress. While Swamiji was alive, at that time, there have been several attempts to bring traditions together with a view to creating harmony. I can say that unless Muslims abandon this kind of thinking, they cannot progress. While Swamiji was alive, at that time, there have been several attempts to bring traditions together with a view to creating harmony.

32:35 The culmination of this effort was actually the Parliament of World Religions that took place in Chicago in 1893. Swamiji was aware that harmony among religions of the world still remains merely a goal. The culmination of this effort was actually the Parliament of World Religions that took place in Chicago in 1893. Swamiji was aware that harmony among religions of the world still remains merely a goal.

32:51 He had frankly admitted that so far that goal has not been reached because of a want of a plan that is practical. He had frankly admitted that so far that goal has not been reached because of a want of a plan that is practical.

33:01 He wrote, "That plan alone is practical, which does not destroy the individuality of any man in religion, and at the same time shows him a point of union with all others." I now come to the fourth of the cluster of questions. He wrote, "That plan alone is practical, which does not destroy the individuality of any man in religion, and at the same time shows him a point of union with all others." I now come to the fourth of the cluster of questions.

33:20 Please take a few minutes each and indicate a plan of action so that a point of union among diverse religious traditions can be demonstrated as achievable on a collective plane. Please take a few minutes each and indicate a plan of action so that a point of union among diverse religious traditions can be demonstrated as achievable on a collective plane.

33:36 What is it that we are not doing because of which you think that diversity leads to dissensions even in our time when technology has bridged physical distance in an unprecedented manner, giving us opportunity to know about each other's traditions as much as we want to What is it that we are not doing because of which you think that diversity leads to dissensions even in our time when technology has bridged physical distance in an unprecedented manner, giving us opportunity to know about each other's traditions as much as we want to

33:58 ? How do we transform ourselves so that in our zeal to emphasize our distinctness, we no longer feel the need to overlook the overlaps that are there and get ready to recognize our shared common values? ? How do we transform ourselves so that in our zeal to emphasize our distinctness, we no longer feel the need to overlook the overlaps that are there and get ready to recognize our shared common values?

34:17 Diversity or difference are part of nature. Diversity or difference are part of nature.

34:25 We cannot eliminate the difference from life. So the only option before us is to learn the art of management. We cannot eliminate the difference from life. So the only option before us is to learn the art of management.

34:41 We have to learn the art of management of differences rather than try to eliminate it We have to learn the art of management of differences rather than try to eliminate it

34:49 . This is the first formula that I derived from my Islamic studies. . This is the first formula that I derived from my Islamic studies.

35:01 Then, according to my experience, difference is not an evil, not at all. Then, according to my experience, difference is not an evil, not at all.

35:12 Difference is a blessing. Why? Difference is a blessing. Why?

35:18 Because difference Because difference

35:24 creates challenge. Challenge leads to discussion, and discussion results into development, intellectual development. creates challenge. Challenge leads to discussion, and discussion results into development, intellectual development.

35:35 This is the formula of life. I always invite differences. This is the formula of life. I always invite differences.

35:41 I always invite criticism because it is criticism and difference I always invite criticism because it is criticism and difference

35:50 through which we can develop our mind, our personality. So this is my experience about differences. through which we can develop our mind, our personality. So this is my experience about differences.

36:01 Then, if this is the situation, then what is the solution? Then, if this is the situation, then what is the solution?

36:08 According to Islam, the solution lies in According to Islam, the solution lies in

36:16 the same formula which I cited earlier, that "Follow one and respect all." Here, I would like to give a very beautiful example from the life of the Prophet of Islam. the same formula which I cited earlier, that "Follow one and respect all." Here, I would like to give a very beautiful example from the life of the Prophet of Islam.

36:33 You know, when the Prophet of Islam migrated to Madinah, you know, he started his mission in Makkah, then he migrated to Madinah. You know, when the Prophet of Islam migrated to Madinah, you know, he started his mission in Makkah, then he migrated to Madinah.

36:44 At that time, there were basically two groups: Muslims and Jews, roughly half-half. At that time, there were basically two groups: Muslims and Jews, roughly half-half.

36:56 So the Prophet of Islam issued a declaration that is called "Sahifatul Madinah." It means So the Prophet of Islam issued a declaration that is called "Sahifatul Madinah." It means

37:10 declaration. It means the Madinah Declaration. In this declaration, it was mentioned that, declaration. It means the Madinah Declaration. In this declaration, it was mentioned that,

37:21 "For Jews, their religion; for Muslims, their religion." This is the best art, the best formula of management. "For Jews, their religion; for Muslims, their religion." This is the best art, the best formula of management.

37:31 So what happened? The Prophet himself gave an example. One day, he was in some part of Madinah, So what happened? The Prophet himself gave an example. One day, he was in some part of Madinah,

37:46 and he saw a funeral procession passing through a street in Madinah at that time. and he saw a funeral procession passing through a street in Madinah at that time.

37:55 So the Prophet was seated at that tim So the Prophet was seated at that tim

37:59 e He stood up in respect of that Jewish funeral. One of the companions said, "O Prophet, it was the funeral of a Jew, not a Muslim." The Prophet replied, e. He stood up in respect of that Jewish funeral. One of the companions said, "O Prophet, it was the funeral of a Jew, not a Muslim." The Prophet replied,

38:17 "Alasat nafsan, was he not a human being? Was he not a human being "Alasat nafsan, was he not a human being? Was he not a human being

38:28 ?" Here, you can see that the Prophet was able to discover the commonality between himself and that non-Muslim. ?" Here, you can see that the Prophet was able to discover the commonality between himself and that non-Muslim.

38:38 So this kind of artificial partition that he is Muslim, he is non-Muslim, this is wrong. So this kind of artificial partition that he is Muslim, he is non-Muslim, this is wrong.

38:50 Everyone was born by God Almighty. Everyone is a human being. So he said, "Alasat nafsan, was he not a human being?" And when he is a human being, and I am also a human being, so this is the true commonality. Everyone was born by God Almighty. Everyone is a human being. So he said, "Alasat nafsan, was he not a human being?" And when he is a human being, and I am also a human being, so this is the true commonality.

39:08 So this is theright solution to the question of difference or diversity. So this is theright solution to the question of difference or diversity.

39:20 So according to my experience, this is the simplest and natural formula. So according to my experience, this is the simplest and natural formula.

39:29 Simplest and natural formula: "Follow one and respect all." And I have no hate against anyone. Simplest and natural formula: "Follow one and respect all." And I have no hate against anyone.

39:38 I can sit with I can sit with

39:44 total total

39:48 love and compassion with anyone. I have no hate in my mind, in my heart. So why? love and compassion with anyone. I have no hate in my mind, in my heart. So why?

39:58 Because I always see man as a creation of God. Everyone is a creation of God. Because I always see man as a creation of God. Everyone is a creation of God.

40:07 You all are creations of God. So why do I hate? There is no difference. You all are creations of God. So why do I hate? There is no difference.

40:15 So this is the only formula of living in harmony. In this world, it is impossible to eliminate the differ So this is the only formula of living in harmony. In this world, it is impossible to eliminate the differ

40:28 ences. So we have to learn the art of management. ences. So we have to learn the art of management.

40:36 And by following this formula, we can establish a society of harmony. And by following this formula, we can establish a society of harmony.

40:50 Well, actually, this has been an amazing experience for me, from the moment of conceptualization to the unfolding of this event. Well, actually, this has been an amazing experience for me, from the moment of conceptualization to the unfolding of this event.

40:58 Now Now

40:59 , I know we are in short of time. So let me just express my thanks to eminent personalities like His Holiness Dalai Lama, Maulana Vaiduddin Khan, , I know we are in short of time. So let me just express my thanks to eminent personalities like His Holiness Dalai Lama, Maulana Vaiduddin Khan,

41:12 Dr. Karan Singh, and Reverend Tutu, that because they have so readily accepted my invitation to join this conversational format, which is a little bit different than the other conferences where we get mostly a series of monologues. Dr. Karan Singh, and Reverend Tutu, that because they have so readily accepted my invitation to join this conversational format, which is a little bit different than the other conferences where we get mostly a series of monologues.

41:31 And I am really grateful that they have responded so candidly, so sincerely to the questions that we have asked. And I am really grateful that they have responded so candidly, so sincerely to the questions that we have asked.